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Joe_jenkins (Joe_jenkins)
Advanced Member
Username: Joe_jenkins

Post Number: 41
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Thursday, October 14, 2010 - 08:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It would just be the exposure plus the headlap.
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Mbazikos (Mbazikos)
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Username: Mbazikos

Post Number: 26
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Tuesday, October 12, 2010 - 09:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

For a mitered hip, wouldn't the slip flashing be the headlap + exposure + 2", and 8"w, bent down the middle? So for my 18" slates, the hip flashings would need to be 11.5"x8"? Am I correct?
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Joe (Joe)
Moderator
Username: Joe

Post Number: 573
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Saturday, October 09, 2010 - 01:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Have you looked at the slate hip and ridge page on this site: http://www.slateroofcentral.com/install_hips_ridges.htm

The flashings are rectangular and should overlap each other at least two inches. So the flashings would be the length of your exposure plus two inches.

16X16 diamond flashings on closed valleys is what we use most of the time unless the slate is really small. We use 20 ounce copper.
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Mbazikos (Mbazikos)
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Username: Mbazikos

Post Number: 25
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Friday, October 08, 2010 - 01:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Joe, In a very short time my ca.1900 home will be reslated. It has a hipped roof with dormers and 2 gables. The slate is 18"R Peach Bottom. What size flashing would you recommend to flash the mitered hips? Would it be diamond shaped or rectangular? And what size would you use for closed valleys? Would it be 16"x16"? Thanks, Michael B.
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Braymer (Braymer)
Senior Member
Username: Braymer

Post Number: 133
Registered: 09-2008
Posted on Thursday, September 24, 2009 - 07:16 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

That is some very good work. That is very high end stuff compared to what I usually do, which is just trying to get people with little money to keep their slate roofs. You should have more photos and examples available for people to see. I was quite surprized when I saw the level of your work and more people should see that. Good stuff.
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Branden_wilson (Branden_wilson)
Intermediate Member
Username: Branden_wilson

Post Number: 33
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 03:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

thanks planejane, you're doing a great job. you wouldn't believe how bad many self proclaimed "pros" screw up slate roofs. the main reason is usually ignorance and it's obvious that's not a problem you have! the more you do, the more you get to try different things. i'm glad you enjoy my work, that is me at the end. i'm not a big contractor, i really struggle but i maintain my principals. i was inspired by the slate roof bible and have learned a lot more from TR mag and the folks here. you're in the right place and doing the right thing, keep it up!

i put together another video of some mitred hips
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh5h1jXla_c
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Planejane (Planejane)
Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 25
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 02:30 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

WOW Branden!!! I don't know what else to say but WOW!!! You are REALLY GOOD! Is that you at the end? I still have the other side of my roof to do so, if I can figure out everything you said and apply it, I may just try and do it.
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Branden_wilson (Branden_wilson)
Intermediate Member
Username: Branden_wilson

Post Number: 32
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 01:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

thanks guys, joe...that slate is from brazil, i didn't really like it. it doesn't cut well with traditional tools and the color seems to be coming from a rust and bleeds down the roof. i actually prefer high quality chinese multi-color over this one. i have worked with some great slates from brazil though.

planejane, a "w" would be tuff without a break. it's not completely necessary though. as for the dormers, i layout and chalk every course so that the roof looks kinda like graph paper before i slate. i divide any courses i have to adjust into the entire roof so things meet together. when i'm working with random slates and patterns i don't chalk as much but when i only have single sized slates to work with, i prefer straight lines. with the hips and ridges, i begin with high quality pine or better 1" x 3"s screwed 8"oc with 3"stainless screws. i find that a good, solid, straight nailer is extremely helpful if you prefer straight hips and ridges. also, for many applications i like to install my saddle hips and ridges with headlap as well as a cap cant and starter. this gives a more "built up" profile that is sometimes desired. i do use three 3" stainless 10 guage slate nails per cap. i begin by lining up the caps where i want them, then i pound in the "front nail"(the nail closest to the exposure) then i close the caps together a little tighter than i want them to end up before nailing in the back nail then the middle one. the caps should end up right where you want them when you let go.

in south florida, i am required my miami dade code to include roof cement in between saddle hips and ridges. i have to lay a bed of cement just like a step flashing between each pair of caps. at first, i was really against this but after installing a few this way and following their performance, i have to say done properly, this works well. the cement eventually hardens and makes for a very tough hip or ridge. i still prefer traditional methods but in south florida you have to install by miami dade standards and currently there are 5 inspections from start to finish to verify ones' compliance.

thanks much guys for all the comments, i'm working on getting the images right, here's a video i recently made if anyone's interested.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2SOcZW58pw
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Tinner666 (Tinner666)
Intermediate Member
Username: Tinner666

Post Number: 40
Registered: 02-2009
Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 09:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nice looking job!
<A HREF="http://www.albertsroofing.com" TARGET="_blank">Slate Roof Repairs, Richmond, Va.</A>
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Planejane (Planejane)
Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 24
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 09:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Branden, that looks beautiful! You need a break to do the W in the valley, right? I only have a mallet and the edge of my work table. And, for the "mirror valley" do both the pitch of the dormer and the house have to be the same? Also, for the ridge, I take it you didn't use caulk? How did you get the top so tight? With 3 nails to hold it in place which is what I do but it doesn't always stay perfectly tight.
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Braymer (Braymer)
Senior Member
Username: Braymer

Post Number: 131
Registered: 09-2008
Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 02:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

That looks sweet. Try reducing the file size or size of the photos, they have to be less than 8 or 10 megs to upload here I think. Nice slated hips and ridge too. Put up more photos if you can, I would like to see more of this. or try to use gmail/ picassa for images.
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Joe (Joe)
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 451
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Monday, September 21, 2009 - 01:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How do you like working with that - what - Chinese multi-color?
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Slate_man (Slate_man)
Senior Member
Username: Slate_man

Post Number: 482
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 06:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nice work very clean.
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Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 243
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Friday, September 18, 2009 - 10:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Brandon, good to hear from you again. Nice valley!
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Branden_wilson (Branden_wilson)
Intermediate Member
Username: Branden_wilson

Post Number: 31
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Friday, September 18, 2009 - 03:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

<img src="http://api.photoshop.com/home_e3bda43ebf27479689fad794316f21cb/adobe-px-assets/eb18278cc3ae45a199a4065a2d030ea4" width="450" height="337"/>


http://www.photoshop.com/accounts/e3bda43ebf27479689fad794316f21cb/assets/eb1827 8cc3ae45a199a4065a2d030ea4

i try to install closed valleys as much as possible. whenever possible, i really like to line up the courses horizontally to create what i like to call a "mirror valley". also, when making the "w" metal for the valleys, i make sure to bend the center of the "w" at 1/2" x 1/2" instead of the usuall 3/4" x 3/4" so that there is still a "w" to help create a perfect line but yet it's small enough so that the metal is not seen at all once the installation is complete.

(Message edited by branden wilson on September 18, 2009) nevermind, i can't figure out how to get photos on this site.....just forget it

(Message edited by branden wilson on September 18, 2009)
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Planejane (Planejane)
Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 23
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, September 10, 2009 - 03:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Don't forget to put in snow guards!
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Jimmyjim (Jimmyjim)
Junior Member
Username: Jimmyjim

Post Number: 12
Registered: 08-2009
Posted on Thursday, September 10, 2009 - 01:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks for your reply. Yes, I'll be doing it myself, but I have to install a built in copper gutter 1st. Had some quotes for asphalt and epdm rubber that were very expensive. That's when I started looking at slate. Most roofers that I asked just rolled there eyes when I mention slate. One guy said "what are you gonna do, pull out a lawn chair and stare at your roof all day?" I figure If I can do it myself I'll save quite a bit and it will be done right. Provided of course I do it right, which I intend to do. Safe, slow and steady. I bought a scaffold a while back to work on the side of my house anyway-may as well make more use of it with the roof.

Didn't even think of just ordering some without holes punched-duh-thanks! I'll probably just order all of the slate at once since I don't have a truck anyway. Oh and that's 11x22 slates that I have not 11x12 which I mention below.

I think your roof is looking really great and look forward to seeing pics of your progress in the future.
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Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 238
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Thursday, September 10, 2009 - 05:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Everyone could use that much patience! I try and make sure not to ask the Good Lord for patience. You might just end up with a 3-5 year project! Nice work!
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Planejane (Planejane)
Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 21
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Wednesday, September 09, 2009 - 10:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, like I said, I'm not a professional! I only buy 2 squares at a time but have been very lucky. I can't see any difference in my slates (thank goodness). I'm so painfully slow because it's hard to work a full time job and put a massive roof on your house. I also don't have a lot of room to store them. I've been working on this project for 3 years and gotten a 3 car garage, 2 sheds and half the back of my house done so far. My house is like 2 small houses side by side. The first 1/2 of the back was 20 rows X 26 feet, that's done and the second half of the back is 24 rows X 36 feet. That's the section I'm working on now. I'm about half way finished that section. I looked at it all and can't tell any difference in the slate colors. Thank goodness! I'll keep your recommendation in mind for the next section.
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Old_school (Old_school)
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Username: Old_school

Post Number: 237
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Wednesday, September 09, 2009 - 07:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If freezing and thawing hurt the slates, they wouldn't be worth a hoot on the roof. Just keep a tarp over them so that they don't freeze together on the pallet. That makes them hard to get apart so that you can lay them.

Jane, good for you that you used scaffolding. That is the way that the "big contractors" do it and it is much safer. It is neat that you live that close to the quarry. Shipping small quantities would be cost prohibitive up here in Michigan.
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Joe (Joe)
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 442
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Wednesday, September 09, 2009 - 04:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The problem with not buying all your slate at once is that each batch may be a slightly different shade that will be obvious only after the roof is installed and you're standing back looking at it from a distance. If you must buy in small quantities over a period of time, buy enough to do one entire roof area (hip end, dormer side, etc.) and finish that area completely with one batch of slate.

Here's a photo of black Spanish slates from different batches not blended together before installing. The owner did NOT like the look of it:

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Planejane (Planejane)
Junior Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 20
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Wednesday, September 09, 2009 - 01:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are you doing this project yourself? If so, you may not want to get all the slate at once. I don't know how big your roof is but storing slate isn't something you want to do. This is a question for the many professionals on this web site but, freezing and thawing over the winter may cause cracking. Animals, bugs, and insects take up residence in them. Worms make a mess with worm dirt. Good for the garden but you have to clean up the mess before you can put them on. Extra work for you.
You will need both, with and without holes. I would start with maybe 3 squares, 2 with holes and 1 without. I studied the "Slate Roof Bible" for about a year before I started. I found all the best prices for what I thought I needed and bought the best tools. I don't mind buying top end scaffolding, after all, you get to keep it at the end of the project. You can use it to paint the house with when you finish the roof! By the time you get finished the roof you'll need to paint.
Call that guy John for information. He is right at the quarry. You can pick the slate up from him. It's only 15 minutes from NJ. The other site they have is farther away. I have a little pickup truck so I pick up my own slate.
I don't mind answering questions but remember this is my first roofing job. I've learned a lot but the guys on this web site are the professionals. They are a really good source of information. I can tell you all the little things I've done to make the job go easier. Things the pros take for granted. Things like this question about buying slate. Unless you can store it I wouldn't buy everything you need all at once. If you can't pick it up yourself I still would break the project up into 2 or 4 sections and buy what you think you need for each section.
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Jimmyjim (Jimmyjim)
Junior Member
Username: Jimmyjim

Post Number: 11
Registered: 08-2009
Posted on Tuesday, September 08, 2009 - 10:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh good, I was hoping you were going to say that. I just ordered a sample from them along with a quote for 13sq. of 11x12 about a week ago. Didn't speak to John though-told me 6 weeks. Sorry, just one more question- did you get them with or without the nailholes? Thanks!
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Planejane (Planejane)
Junior Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 19
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, September 08, 2009 - 09:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks, I buy my slate at Penn Big Bed Slate in Pen Argyl, PA. You can call John at 610-390-2216. He is the Boss out there. They are very nice to work with. Call ahead to place your order. If they don't have it it only takes a day or two to get it.
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Jimmyjim (Jimmyjim)
New member
Username: Jimmyjim

Post Number: 10
Registered: 08-2009
Posted on Tuesday, September 08, 2009 - 09:45 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hey that looks great! I'm going to start my 1st. slate project soon I hope- I'm in Highland Park, NJ. Can I ask where you got your slate?
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Jimmyjim (Jimmyjim)
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Username: Jimmyjim

Post Number: 9
Registered: 08-2009
Posted on Tuesday, September 08, 2009 - 09:29 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hey that looks great! I'm going to start my 1st. slate project soon I hope- I'm in Highland Park, NJ. Can I ask where you got your slate?
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Planejane (Planejane)
Junior Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 18
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Monday, September 07, 2009 - 08:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks!
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Joe (Joe)
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Username: Joe

Post Number: 438
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Monday, September 07, 2009 - 03:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nice work.
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Slate_man (Slate_man)
Senior Member
Username: Slate_man

Post Number: 475
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Sunday, September 06, 2009 - 07:59 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What you have done is fine too. Most roof would end up as you did.
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Planejane (Planejane)
Junior Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 16
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Sunday, September 06, 2009 - 07:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Slate man, thanks for your input. I understand what you are saying. The original slate roof was done the way I did it. I wanted to do what you said and match them up but didn't know quite how to go about it so I just took one dormer down and copied what they did, more or less. The original dormer only had 4 rows I actually added a row to the dormer. The best way to learn this stuff is do it! I still have the other side to do. By the time I get there I'm hoping to have all my questions worked out. Thanks again.
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Planejane (Planejane)
Junior Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 15
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Sunday, September 06, 2009 - 07:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I start my next valley today or tomorrow. I think I understand how you want me to do it. Some of those slates were cut up to 6 times just to get them perfect. It's like an art project. It was painfully sloowww! I did get better, but there is room for a lot of improvement time wise.
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Slate_man (Slate_man)
Senior Member
Username: Slate_man

Post Number: 471
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Sunday, September 06, 2009 - 07:23 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you had added a course of slate below the dormer, that would of help you make you course line up with the dormer roof. This would make some of the course smaller, with more headlap, this would of pushed the course up. Even if the pitches are a little different that should work.
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Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 231
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Saturday, September 05, 2009 - 09:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It looks like you are having fun, why should we interfere? It looks like your slates are about 12 inches wide. If you lay one of them with the long side butting into the valley and set a slate along your line, you should be able to scribe a line on the slate set on the line and the angle will be exact. Any parallel line will do: maybe a piece of aluminum about 12 inches wide or so. Just save the pattern after the first one and the rest should match up just fine. Nice job.
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Planejane (Planejane)
Junior Member
Username: Planejane

Post Number: 12
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Saturday, September 05, 2009 - 09:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've done 6 closed valleys that took me forever. But, I'm proud to show one of them off. Please write more about them. Maybe you have some tricks for cutting the right angle the first time? I still have 6 to do.IMG_2636_2

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