Safest roof access Log Out | Topics | Search
Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Slate Roof Central Message Board » Slate Roofs » Safest roof access « Previous Next »

Author Message
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Kwhord (Kwhord)
Senior Member
Username: Kwhord

Post Number: 275
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Wednesday, October 09, 2013 - 08:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

83b: major props on the sweep valley top: especially from a DIYER!!!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

83b (83b)
New member
Username: 83b

Post Number: 7
Registered: 01-2013
Posted on Friday, September 13, 2013 - 10:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thought you guys might get a kick out of seeing my DIY efforts. This junk takes a lot of time. I'm starting with a dormer roof with valley replacement. One must really pay attention to craft. Many of the new slates vary in size slightly, some shorter, others not quite square, great variance in thickness from one slate to another etc. It's tedious. Took me a full day to make that valley...

dormer

dormer
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Joe (Joe)
Moderator
Username: Joe

Post Number: 792
Registered: 07-2006


Posted on Thursday, June 13, 2013 - 11:48 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

83B: Bigger slates are easier to install (less per square) and no one will notice the different exposure. Save the money and use the larger slates.

And yes, putting new on the front and using the salvaged slates to repair the remainder is a very good approach.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Kwhord (Kwhord)
Senior Member
Username: Kwhord

Post Number: 259
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 12, 2013 - 05:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Although it's not the best solution aesthetically.. I think re-slating one whole face and using the remaining slates for restoration on the other faces is a very prudent choice. This is the best-case scenario on a budget.

Also, as far as changing the size / exposure: it really depends on taste. If you want to have the same exposure as the other faces, you could cut them down to 12.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

83b (83b)
New member
Username: 83b

Post Number: 5
Registered: 01-2013
Posted on Wednesday, June 12, 2013 - 02:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry for not putting this into a new topic, but I'm finally getting around to getting started on this roof and have a couple of additional questions:

Got a very nice looking sample from Buckingham Slate here in VA. Photo shows the new sample next to the existing roof. Overall it's a good match, although there are places where current roof is stained (rust) and seemingly faded (although they say buckingham slate is unfading).

My plan is replace the front of the house with the new Bucks and use the remaining good slates to repair the other three sides of the roof. Without having a huge stash of salvaged slates in the correct size, does this plan make sense? I seem to remember you folks saying not to mix new slate with old.

Question #2:
I have 9 x 12 slates with what appears to be 3.5in headlap and a 4.25 reveal. Right now they're offering 14in slates on SALE at roughly half price. If my drawing is correct, I could purchase 9 x 14in slates, increase headlap to 4, and have a 5in. reveal. Does this seem do-able considering I could save over $2000?

Any thoughts appreciated!

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 944
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Thursday, January 10, 2013 - 08:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ahhh, Reality sets in eh? I know it is daunting, but you will notice that I told you that you have about 2 months of work up there. after setting the scaffold on the first 1/4 of the building and doing all of it, the rest is just an absolute "repeat" of the first section. You will get better at it as you go along and it will be easier and faster. You are also right that you can take care of a bunch of things with the scaffold in place. that is another reason we use it all the time. You have 4 chimneys to point and patch too. When you or whomever are done with it, your roof should be totally refurbished from the soffit line up! all scraped, primed and painted, flashings re-caulked and sealed, gutters relined with expansion joints, new copper valleys, and a totally "fixed" slate roof. It sounds like a lot of fun and something we deal with all the time, but still a lot of work. BTW, look at your overhead picture again. It looks like the upper right chimney has the cap either new or coated with something white. The lower right is also different looking than the others and the two on the left look like they are original. they are a long way up and no one would be "temped" to work on them without a specific reason. EVERYTHING is going to want to be addressed when you do the work. if you do, please post pictures and we can help you as you go along. good luck, it is a lot of work.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Blue_sky_roofing (Blue_sky_roofing)
Senior Member
Username: Blue_sky_roofing

Post Number: 63
Registered: 05-2010
Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2013 - 10:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah, that front dormer is different. Why they didn't just extend their rafters on up and make it one dormer instead of putting that ravine in there...

Architects... you gotta love them.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Blue_sky_roofing (Blue_sky_roofing)
Senior Member
Username: Blue_sky_roofing

Post Number: 62
Registered: 05-2010
Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2013 - 10:46 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

1 crucial advice if you place a ladder resting behind a plank supported by slater's roof bracket:
Nail or screw the plank through a predrilled hole in the bracket!

I once was working on a steep pitch roof using the upper most notch in the roof bracket with the ladder resting against a 2x10 plank. The plank was against the outside lip (backstop) of bracket and it jumped out. (When using the upper most notches, the outside backstop of the bracket is at a pretty good angle - almost not a backstop anymore, but more like a ramp) Me and the ladder dropped about 4". When I looked behind me, 80% of the plank was outside of the bracket sticking up 45* in the air and the ladder was balancing pecariously on the edge of the plank. The ladder had pinched the last 2" of the plank against, and at the same angle, of the backstop of the bracket. I sure used my guardian angels that day!

(Message edited by Blue Sky Roofing on January 09, 2013)
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

83b (83b)
New member
Username: 83b

Post Number: 4
Registered: 01-2013
Posted on Wednesday, January 09, 2013 - 10:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I was confident with my ability to handle the slate work, but entering the world of metal fabrication on the gutters seems like a whole new ballgame. I will probably seek professional help with that. The valley between the front double-dormers is strange and I haven't gotten a close look at it yet.

Thanks for the tips John. I think the extra cost for scaffolding would be worth it. Heck I could use that for a whole lot of other projects.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 939
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2013 - 03:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hey, one more thing! That is sure to be lead paint on the sides of the dormers and on all the metal and trim, so be aware of that BEFORE you take anything apart. DON'T try and torch it off as it will gas off and it will get into your lungs etc.
Watch out for scrapping it too, especially if you have young children. Contain it with plastic and bag it and get it out of there before you do any other work. THEN prime the bare surfaces, then take apart the slate from top down and fix them, replacing the valleys and such until you get to the bottom and the gutters. Replace the gutters with expansion joints, then finish painting and then tear down and do the next section. If you are working by yourself, you have about 2 months of work to do. Be ready for that and good luck. PS. no matter what the other guys say, I would still scaffold it if it were me and my job. That's just the way I roll though and I have a lot of scaffold. Especially if you are working by yourself, the extra time spent erecting the scaffold will be more than offset by the ease of working and the added safety factor. JMHO
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 938
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2013 - 03:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Looks like that pipe comes from the top of the dormer, and from the overhead picture it slopes back to the middle and then out. Are those steel valleys? It looks like they are rusted and that doesn't make any sense at all considering the ridges and gutters are all copper.

The guys are right in that you can "walk" that roof rather easily as it is not that steep. I would still set scaffold sections around it to work on as when you get to the point of redoing the built in gutters it will be easier to be standing at waist height to do that work. You will want to make expansion joints at the ends of the scaffold anyway as there should be one in the middle of each side and that would be ideal. You will also be tearing apart the bottom two rows of slates to get the apron beneath the slates too and that is much safer to be doing from a scaffold than from on the roof beneath yourself. Just a thought.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Slate_man (Slate_man)
Senior Member
Username: Slate_man

Post Number: 764
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2013 - 09:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

All you need is to be tied off and some roof brakets. That gutter is big enough to do all of the work. Do most of the repair then replace the gutter, that way you will not damage the gutter from falling slates. Maybe one tower would be good to get up and down rather then going in a window.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

83b (83b)
New member
Username: 83b

Post Number: 3
Registered: 01-2013
Posted on Monday, January 07, 2013 - 02:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks guys.

I'm going to take my time and be safe about it. I may not get to everything all at once, but what I do will be done correctly. Lots of broken slates complete with tar application!

The copper drain pipe running between the two front dormers was particularly interesting.

drain

roughness
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Joe (Joe)
Moderator
Username: Joe

Post Number: 753
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Saturday, January 05, 2013 - 01:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

We work on roofs like that frequently. We always have a couple of 4' 2X10 planks in the truck for this purpose, as well as roof jacks (roof brackets such as http://josephjenkins.com/store/Acro_19600_Brackets.html or other brackets that you can buy at Lowes). Nail the roof jacks onto the roof in between two slates with 16 penny common nails. Space the brackets approximately 3' apart, maybe 4' then lay the plank across them. Now you have a small roof platform you can stand on. Pull up a single ladder section and set the feet on the plank as the ladder lies on the roof. Now you can get up the roof. Bring a hook ladder up with you (looks like you'll need a 20' hook ladder). Between the roof ladder and the hook ladder, you can reach all parts of this roof. Just move the roof scaffold from place to place along the eaves as needed.

When you take the roof jacks off, punch the nails down and slide a bib over them. Yoou can also pull the nails out, but 16p nails are hard to pull without breaking slates. Looks like about a 6:12 slope. I can access that entire roof without any roof scaffolding or hook ladders by climbing up a hip. I only do this when I do roof inspections as a consultant. If I had to work on the roof, I'd use the roof jacks and plank method coupled with hook ladders. You can hook a ladder on the short ridge and angle it down the roof on two of the sides.

Alternatively, you can pull a couple slates off using a ripper, then nail the roof jacks between the two underlying slates. This way you don't have to puncture any slates with nails. Either way works fine.

I have a short video clip showing this procedure here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwSyqUKRLdA&feature=share&list=PLCAFA8B61D36361D8
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 933
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2013 - 11:08 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Actually, it is not all that difficult to set a scaffold, and when you go and rent some, they will have all of the things you will need to put it up right. The most important thing is to set it on a solid base and LEVEL the first tier. If it doesn't go together from there on up, you don't have it level. Use a actual level to check plumb and flat. I would also get enough scaffold to set a tower on the flat roofs so that you can access the areas next to the dormers and to the tops of them too.

4 set ups and tear downs and a whole lot safer and faster in the long run. IF you insist on doing it yourself, I would insist that you do it safely and with minimum risk.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Belgiumslate (Belgiumslate)
Member
Username: Belgiumslate

Post Number: 23
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2013 - 09:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

nice roof
i agree with Chris dont get killed and hire a professional
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

83b (83b)
New member
Username: 83b

Post Number: 2
Registered: 01-2013
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2013 - 01:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks Old School and Blue Sky. I guess I need to not skimp on stable infrastructure. I've got porch roofs to spring up from on all but one side of the house. Seems like setting that stuff up can be as much work as doing the actual repairs. I'm still stoked about getting up there though.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Old_school (Old_school)
Senior Member
Username: Old_school

Post Number: 932
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2013 - 09:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If I was to do that roof, I would set some scaffold along the bottom. It looks like 15-- 6" 6"' walk thru frames and about 20 planks would do the trick. You would just set up 1/4 of the roof at a time and fix everything, then move to the next section. Not easy, but safe and if you have a lot to fix, much faster and soooo much safer and peace of mind. That is how we roll anyway.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Chris (Chris)
Senior Member
Username: Chris

Post Number: 172
Registered: 09-2009
Posted on Wednesday, January 02, 2013 - 11:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

quote "This is all very large-scale and very high off the ground. I would rather not get killed.
Any thoughts appreciated"
-Jason

hire a professional
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Blue_sky_roofing (Blue_sky_roofing)
Senior Member
Username: Blue_sky_roofing

Post Number: 58
Registered: 05-2010
Posted on Wednesday, January 02, 2013 - 07:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

WOW! What a house you have! Looks like 40' ladder stuff there.
What I do for this roof design is use a slaters bracket SCREWED inbetween 2 slate (so a bib can be slid in later after your done). I then place the bottom rung of an 'appropriate length' ladder inside the bracket so it is pushing against the part that is in the notches. BUT...
in your case, I think I would go ahead and install 2 brackets and a plank first, just for psychological reasons; and then the bracket/ladder combination from there on up.

The screws I use for fastening the bracket are for Imperial sheet metal roofing which has a hex head and washer. Use at least 3 screws and that they take a good 'bite' into the wood (THERE ARE NO 2ND CHANCES IN ROOFING!!!). If you use nails, you may brake the slate trying to pull them back out; or else you can drive them on through the slate to the roof deck and then install bib flashing.

Be carefull when working off the ladder that you don't push side ways on it as there is nothing holding the top of the ladder in place.

(Message edited by Blue Sky Roofing on January 02, 2013)
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

83b (83b)
New member
Username: 83b

Post Number: 1
Registered: 01-2013
Posted on Wednesday, January 02, 2013 - 03:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've read all I can about repairing slate and am anxious to get started on my house. Really appreciate the effort you folks are making (especially Joe) to teach others. My questions are regarding how best to access my roof. One thing you folks don't talk at length about is the overall DESIGN of scaffolding, ladder placement etc.

As you see from the enclosed image, a hook ladder would do me no good. I have many slates to replace and will need to get access to every area of this roof. Will I need to constantly move roof jacks up and down and work my way up? Could I prop ladders against the sides of the chimneys? I'll also need to get to the tops of those dormers and have no idea how that would be accomplished. I've seen a few videos with a guy who stood on a sheet of plywood with non-slip foam on the bottom. This was a very low pitch roof however. Do you guys use ropes and safety harnesses?

This is all very large-scale and very high off the ground. I would rather not get killed.

Any thoughts appreciated.

-Jason

my roof

Add Your Message Here
Post:
Username: Posting Information:
This is a private posting area. Only registered users and moderators may post messages here.
Password:
Options: Enable HTML code in message
Automatically activate URLs in message
Action:

Topics | Last Day | Last Week | Tree View | Search | User List | Help/Instructions | Program Credits Administration