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Joseph m. Glasser
Posted on Thursday, September 06, 2001 - 12:12 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

slate on 2/12 pitch porch roof closed off made into an addition.huge pine trees above which add to more problems. ice dams and heavy rains cause problems. homeowner wants the slate roof, and does not want to remove trees. our recomendation, remove slate, apply ice guard , reapply old vermont slate. roof has been on for approx. 5 years. customer happy many refferals. what do you know from your experiance may be a problem with this application.
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Joe Jenkins
Posted on Sunday, September 09, 2001 - 06:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I would not put slate on a 2:12 pitch. Not enough slope.
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mike elling
Posted on Monday, September 10, 2001 - 09:07 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

what is the recommended pitch for installing a slate roof ?
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Joe
Posted on Monday, September 10, 2001 - 10:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Minimum 4:12 (with 4" headlap)
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Kim Weiner
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2001 - 12:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am having a bay window installed on my house, where a flat window existed before. I have a slate roof, and my roofer said he can put slate on the window roof to match.Unfortunately, he does not seem to be very concerned about the materials being used in the roof deck. I have the Slate Bible, and was wondering if it is necessary to use green lumber or solid wood in this case, since the window will likely have a relatively short life compared to the slate. Should I be more concerned about this than my roofer seems to be? Is there any other suggestions you could make to help me with this dilemma?
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Joe Jenkins
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2001 - 04:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You should not put slate on the roof if the slope is lower than 4:12 (4 inches of run in 12 inches of rise). If it is 4:12 or steeper, you can slate it, and 30 lb. felt is all you need as underlayment if the slate is properly installed. I do not recommend any laminated roof sheathing. For a bay window, there is no excuse for not using boards. Three quarter inch thick kiln-dried pine boards will do nicely and are readily available.
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Corbin Wilkes
Posted on Tuesday, January 20, 2004 - 09:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have a 3:12 slope on an existing sunroom on rear of house built in 1954. Slate on heavy tarpaper, has not leaked. Now building connecting room from kitchen to sunroom and want to use same pitch for addition. Roofers suggest that I use ice and water shield with slate or do roof in copper. Since the rest of house is slate, I would prefer copper for overall appearance.

Also, some roofers think ice and water shield goes on top of tar paper. You and others recommend putting it directly on plywood roofing deck.

Do you also recommend putting ice and water shield in valleys?

Comments, please.
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admin
Posted on Tuesday, January 20, 2004 - 10:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It is advisable to put slate only on slopes in excess of 4:12.
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slateworks
Posted on Tuesday, January 20, 2004 - 06:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you install copper on your addition -Do Not Put Ice & water shield under metal roofing-Have seen it create condensation problems-Use rosin paper or 30# felt only-The admin. installs dry valleys-no I&WS-(I should not speak for them)..We have used I&WS or 30# felt and have also installed many dry valleys(No I&WS or felt ,Metal only).They all work if installed properly...If you install I&WS read manufactures directions on box.
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theslateman
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 09:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you are using a closed valley with slates,then ice and water shield could be used.If using an open copper valley,use 30 lb. felt as padding for the deck and sheathing nails,then rosin paper and finally the copper.Copper directly onto sheathing will telegraph all nails slightly raised or board imperfections.
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admin
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 11:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What weight and hardness copper are you referring to? Copper valleys on slate roofs benefit from 20 ounce copper vs 16 ounce and a hardness lever of "half hard" vs. soft (see Slate Roof Bible, 2nd ed., page 235, for mechanical properties of copper) In which case, no underlayment whatsoever is required.

Soft, 16 ounce copper can show underlying nail heads and board gaps as indentations in the valley copper, or reverse indentations, when laid flat against the uncovered roof sheathing, but this is unlikely to occur in the center, exposed part of the valley because that part of the valley metal does not lay tight against the roof unless creased, and, once creased it develops a rigidity. There is no reason to believe that this sort of thing (slight indentations) reduces the life of the valley copper anyway.

30 lb felt is recommended under valley flashing on slate roof installations, but when replacing old valleys on older slate roofs where the original underlayment is gone, underlayment beneath the replaced valley metal is optional. The use of rosin paper under valleys is generally not necessary. Valleys do not expand and contract like large open areas of copper flat roof do. Perhaps extremely large valleys with soldered joints may benefit from rosin paper, but I don't recommend soldered joints on valleys for that very reason (the solder joint can fail over time, whereas overlapped joints will not fail).

Joe Jenkins
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theslateman
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 02:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

IT'S THE OLD ROOFS WHICH WILL BENEFIT THE MOST FROM UNDERLAYMENT UNDER THE VALLEYS SINCE THE SHEATHING AND FASTENERS ARE OLD AND LESS SECURE.yES i USE A vALLEY WITH A CENTER BREAK OF 20 OZ. COPPER,BUT i BELIEVE THAT WEAR CAN TAKE PLACE FROM THE NAIL HEADS THAT ARE SLIGHTLY RAISED.aESTHETICALLY i LIKE THE LOOK BETTER WITH THE 30 LB. FELT AS PADDING.
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monica
Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2004 - 05:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hello,

I'm in the midst of preparing a bid to reroof a very small library, and I have a couple of questions if anybody would mind answering them. I was planning to ice and water sheild as an underlayment over the whole roof, mainly to make sure that there are no leaks while the slate is off ( i'm in new england, and the weather isn't exactly predictable) I've had 30 lb. felt get shredded by the wind, and I don't want to soak the books. Is there any reason not to do this?

This building's roof curves to almost flat in the final two feet above the eaves, and it originally had a sheet of flashing that ran continuous along the eaves. I'm not entirely sure how to deal with the corners, as it has a hip roof. if anyone has any ideas or any suggestions of books etc. I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you.
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Walter Musson
Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2004 - 06:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Using Ice and water shield for temporary protection is both costly and wrong.It won't let vapor escape when the whole roof is covered.If you are removing slates and relaying it then why not just prepare and re-slate one side of the hipped roof at a time.This cuts down on the time each side is left without it's permanent roof.
30 lb. felt can be secured with plastic button top nails which can be slated over and have great holding power to prevent wind uplift.You could also lap the felt more than the customary 2" to 3" and use plenty of buttons to make sure there would be no problems during re-roofing.
The metal "apron" at the eaves should be replaced.Typically it would be formed with 8' or 10' sheets of metal with either locked seams or rivetted and soldered seams.Sometimes shorter lengths were used,but it isn't a single length of continuous metal.The corners need to be locked and folded or again ,rivetted and soldered.
Here in New England I usually use 1 course of Ice and water above and adhered to the top 4" of the metal apron,with 30 lb. felt to cover the balance of the roof.

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