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Joe Jenkins
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 296
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Tuesday, May 20, 2008 - 01:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm not crazy about using fascia as a cant because sometimes the fascia needs to be replaced before the slate does and when it's integrated into the design of the slate roof system, then replacement of the fascia can be problematic. However, when using the fascia as is shown in the diagram, it acts as a batten to support the slate and should work fine as indicated.

The diagram shows the gutter installed way too high. Maybe you don't have snow and ice where you are, but if the gutter was installed like that here in western PA, sliding ice and snow would rip it off and probably the fascia too.

Flashing details for vent pipe penetrations depend on what type of flashing you will be using. Some are pre-fab and some are custom-made to suit the penetration. Pre-fab vent pipe flashings can be seen here (http://josephjenkins.com/store/home.php?cat=273).

Some information about flashing vent pipe penetrations can be read here (http://www.traditionalroofing.com/TR4_readers.html) - 1st question.
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Sarah Johnston
New member
Username: S_johnston

Post Number: 8
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Monday, May 19, 2008 - 06:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've attached the .jpeg drawing. In looking at this detail, my question would be...is is ok that the 'bottom' slate does not rest on the batten?
Also, what are the common flashing details for vent pipe penetrations and stove pipe penetrations in a slate roof?Slate Roof Detail
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Joe Jenkins
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 292
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Thursday, May 15, 2008 - 09:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If it's a jpeg, can you post it here?
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Sarah Johnston
New member
Username: S_johnston

Post Number: 5
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Thursday, May 15, 2008 - 09:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi there. I'm wondering if it would be possible to email you a detail (in .jpeg format)? I think I've sorted everything out, however, the slate that ends up on the base in the area of the headlap is not sitting on a batten which doesn't seem quite right to me.
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Sarah Johnston
New member
Username: S_johnston

Post Number: 4
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Wednesday, May 14, 2008 - 11:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks Joe.
I will have a read through the article. Cheers, Sarah
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Joe Jenkins
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 291
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Wednesday, May 14, 2008 - 09:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Treated wood eats nails that have steel or aluminum in them, so be careful about the type of nails you use. You should read the article about nail holes in roofing slate that is here: http://www.traditionalroofing.com/TR5_hole.html
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Sarah Johnston
New member
Username: S_johnston

Post Number: 3
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Wednesday, May 14, 2008 - 08:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Joe & David! THANKS. I'll try to answer all your questions.
The slate does not come with holes and I have to tell them where I want the holes!!!! It has been suggested that the holes are 4" from the top of the slate and a min. of 1" from the edge of the slate on both sides (you mentioned the 4" from the top is ok, but what is your suggestion for the holes from the edge of the slate?). I like the sound of the US system. I'm actually from south-central PA and have ended up in NZ (married a Kiwi). Unfortunately, TREATED radiata pine is used as battens here (it is CODE). NZ has decided that treating wood is the answer to poor design and construction techniques in order to manage moisture! It's crazy, in my opinion. I was thinking that I would use a raised fascia. The client has rec'd samples of the slate (I haven't seen them). We use 1"x2" battens here.
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Joe Jenkins
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 279
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Saturday, May 03, 2008 - 01:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I should add that a purlin supports rafters, not slate: "Purlin - One of several horizontal timbers supporting the rafters of a roof. (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/purlin).
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Joe Jenkins
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 278
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Saturday, May 03, 2008 - 01:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sarah - do the codes preclude the use of boards rather than battens? I don't see why they would. The Scots have used boards (sarking) for hundreds of years. We have used boards since the 1700s here in the US. It makes a stronger roof and it's easier to install.

Having said that, however, we also install slates on battens from time to time. Sometimes we have to go over a substandard deck, such as OSB (oriented strand board or "particle board") with slate, so we batten it first in order to have something decent for the nails to bite into. The battens are screwed to the OSB. We typically use 1"X4" battens. I think UK battens tend to be smaller.

The batten spacing depends on where your slate nail holes will be. The battens should be positioned so that the slate nail holes line up about dead center on the batten. If the slates already have holes (which they do here in the US - the manufacturers put the holes in them) then you can figure out where the battens should be. Chalk horizontal lines on the roof marking the top edge (or bottom) of the batten and install them along the lines. We always double the battens at the top and bottom edges of the roof.

If the slates do not have holes, you will have to figure out where the holes should be and then hole the slates, then figure out and install the battens, etc., none of which is part of the slate installation process here in the US.

Solid board roof decks (*not* ply, by the way) eliminate the need for calculating batten spacing and allow the manufacturer to install the nail holes in advance. This greatly simplifies and speeds up the slate installation process. This system is tried and proven in the US. Here in western PA, we get about 45 inches of precipitation a year, much of it snow or ice, while our temperatures range from -30 F (-34.4 C) to +104 F (40 C). Solid board roof decks are the norm in this part of the world, and we frequently do restoration work on slate roofs that are 120 years old here. The proof is in the pudding, so to speak.

I might add that, with a solid board roof deck, the headlap can be increased along the drip edge of the roof or on the entire roof without having to change anything - just chalk the lines marking the slate courses accordingly.

If you have too much rain or precipitation where you are located, increase your headlap and make sure your roof is sloped adequately.

Finally, on a solid board deck, the underlayment is installed on top of the boards, not underneath as is done UK style (underneath the battens).
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David Spradlin
Member
Username: David_spradlin

Post Number: 30
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 10:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Not to change the subject, but what type of wood is used for the battens in New Zealand? Just curious.
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David Spradlin
Member
Username: David_spradlin

Post Number: 29
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 10:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

With the fascia detail, are you considering using a raised fascia as opposed to a cant strip?
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David Spradlin
Member
Username: David_spradlin

Post Number: 28
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 10:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sarah, most of the slate we use is 16x8 or 16x10 from China, and most of the time the slates are holed 4" inches from the top of the slate...most of the time. I've also gotten holes from 5 to 6 inches from the top of the slate. If I were you, I'd get both hard samples and written discription of the slates to be shipped from the supplier, so that you know what your getting. I know in Joe's book he says its common in European markets for slates to be sold with no holes at all. So who knows about the New Zealand market. If the slates happen to be holed 4" inches from the top as I discribed above, and a 3" inch headlap is maintained, then the battens should be spaced a 6.5" inches (same as the exposure).
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Sarah Johnston
New member
Username: S_johnston

Post Number: 2
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Thursday, May 01, 2008 - 05:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Joe.
Thank you for your response. Battens (or purlins) is what is typically used here in New Zealand & in it's Standards (Codes). There is no deck (ply) used on the roof. Any suggestions?

Cheers.
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Joe Jenkins
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 276
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Thursday, May 01, 2008 - 02:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sarah - installing slate on battens is a UK style. In the US, we use a solid board deck - not battens - and therefore there is no concern about batten spacing. Instead, we chalk lines on the deck to mark the top edge of the slates. It's much easier, stronger, and faster than the batten system, in my opinion. Use 1" boards or 3/4" boards for the roof deck, at least 6" wide (wider is better).
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Sarah Johnston
New member
Username: S_johnston

Post Number: 1
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 - 05:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have a client who is purchasing slate tile 400mm x 200mm (16"x8") from Peking Slate in China for a new home on the South Island in New Zealand. I've never designed a house with slate roofing and I'm looking for information on batten spacing (I've been told the batten size should be 50mm x 25mm (2"x1")) as well as details showing me the height of the fascia in relationship to the first batten (for the starter row). The company does not provide installation instructions and they recommended that I check out this website. Many thanks.
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Slate Affair Inc.
Senior Member
Username: Slate_man

Post Number: 235
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Wednesday, April 30, 2008 - 05:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are you only using one side of a ladder, or do you have both parts up there.

You can also make your own like I did to reach over rigdes, with a big cap, or a vent. I just bougth some 3/8 x 1 1/2 flat bar.
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Joe Jenkins
Senior Member
Username: Joe

Post Number: 275
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 10:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've used those hooks for 40 years.
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Nick
New member
Username: Nyc_nick

Post Number: 2
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 03:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I got a couple of the standard blue ladder hooks but the loop isn't very big and when in use they only grab the roof a few inches down from the ridge and I don't feel very comfortable with that. I'd feel more comfortable if the loop was bigger and they grabbed say a good foot below the ridge.

Are my fears unwarrented?

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